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	<title>Comments on: DesignIntelligence 2010 Landscape Architecture Program Rankings</title>
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	<description>Connecting the Built &#38; Natural Environments</description>
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		<title>By: g.larson</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-10237</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[g.larson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jan 2012 03:21:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-10237</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[With all due respect, Mr. Landry, as a current BLA student, I appreciate Mr. Lancaster&#039;s honesty.

I could not agree with him more about university programs failing to update their curriculum to better prepare their students for the current job market. For example, my program is highly theory based with excessive redundancy, but yet not a single relevant software course is required. How is that preparing us for a job in the 21st Century? I feel no sense of &quot;pride&quot; in that.

As for your remark about unlicensed professionals &quot;diminishing the respect of landscape architects,&quot; what is enticing about taking on $100,000 in debt to achieve a Masters in order to get licensed in a struggling field? With high unemployment rates and low average salary rates, it hardly seems worth it. My current boss never got any degree and is running a very successful design-build operation, while my dad, a Senior Landscape Architect in the profession for 30 years, has been out of work since 2008. Explain to me how the work my boss is doing is bringing the profession a bad reputation.

It&#039;s unfortunate that landscape architecture has taken such a hit during the recession and that good design has lost any sort of priority. This country certainly has become a sad place (James Howard Kunstler would agree), and could really use the guidance and insight professionals like my dad have to offer. As much as I love it, I don&#039;t know how practical a career in landscape architecture is anymore. I wish that I could say that current students are getting the education they need to deal with these problems. I was glad to see that some established professionals, like Mr. Lancaster, have a grip on reality and have gained some sympathy for students in my position.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With all due respect, Mr. Landry, as a current BLA student, I appreciate Mr. Lancaster&#8217;s honesty.</p>
<p>I could not agree with him more about university programs failing to update their curriculum to better prepare their students for the current job market. For example, my program is highly theory based with excessive redundancy, but yet not a single relevant software course is required. How is that preparing us for a job in the 21st Century? I feel no sense of &#8220;pride&#8221; in that.</p>
<p>As for your remark about unlicensed professionals &#8220;diminishing the respect of landscape architects,&#8221; what is enticing about taking on $100,000 in debt to achieve a Masters in order to get licensed in a struggling field? With high unemployment rates and low average salary rates, it hardly seems worth it. My current boss never got any degree and is running a very successful design-build operation, while my dad, a Senior Landscape Architect in the profession for 30 years, has been out of work since 2008. Explain to me how the work my boss is doing is bringing the profession a bad reputation.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s unfortunate that landscape architecture has taken such a hit during the recession and that good design has lost any sort of priority. This country certainly has become a sad place (James Howard Kunstler would agree), and could really use the guidance and insight professionals like my dad have to offer. As much as I love it, I don&#8217;t know how practical a career in landscape architecture is anymore. I wish that I could say that current students are getting the education they need to deal with these problems. I was glad to see that some established professionals, like Mr. Lancaster, have a grip on reality and have gained some sympathy for students in my position.</p>
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		<title>By: SecondAct</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-9477</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SecondAct]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:52:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-9477</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi All, 

I want to suggest that you go to www.dol.gov go to the A-Z link and click on the Occupational Outlook Handbook.  Look up landscape architecture.  Read about the job growth projections (nicely laid out by region and industry, etc.) and see what you think.  The field is projected to grow by 20% - &quot;much faster than average&quot; vis-a-vis all professions.  The projected job growth between 2008-2018 in absolute numbers is about 5,300 though (or something like that).  Doesn&#039;t seem like many jobs but then again I don&#039;t know how to interpret these numbers. If you look at architects, they&#039;re supposed to grow &quot;faster than average&quot;, but the actual number of new jobs is over 20,000.  The current OOH must have been published in 2007 or 2008 (based on data available at the time I presume)... I wonder if it is going to be updated based on current recession-era data (or if the online version has been already - I haven&#039;t checked).  Anyway, these numbers would make all the difference to me if I were considering studying LA, which in my fantasy life I am, but for me it&#039;s a non-starter.   I am 44, in debt, and not making use of my master&#039;s degree which I am still paying off.  I am under-employed and have no retirement savings.  Read: not a lot of options for a fulfilling work life or happy retirement.  So, my fresh, young landscape architects, be glad that you have your degree, take whatever job you can get to put a roof over your head (like I have had to do), and get ANY LA-related experience you can.  Fortunately you are young and more flexible time-wise, financially, etc. (at least I hope you are!) and you can do internships and possibly unpaid work.  STAY OUT OF DEBT!  And, STAY THE COURSE!!!  If you want to work in LA, you might just have to be patient and ride out the recession.  Jobs in any profession ebb and flow, recession or no recession, it&#039;s cyclical and to be expected.  Get any related experience you can, attend the conferences, etc.  You&#039;ve got to commit to it or  forget it.  And if you don&#039;t have your degree yet, double major.  That is not said to be discouraging, just practical.  Regardless of your major, I would suggest doubling.  It&#039;s just smart.  Good luck all!  I hope your chosen professional works out.  Mine didn&#039;t.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi All, </p>
<p>I want to suggest that you go to <a href="http://www.dol.gov" rel="nofollow">http://www.dol.gov</a> go to the A-Z link and click on the Occupational Outlook Handbook.  Look up landscape architecture.  Read about the job growth projections (nicely laid out by region and industry, etc.) and see what you think.  The field is projected to grow by 20% &#8211; &#8220;much faster than average&#8221; vis-a-vis all professions.  The projected job growth between 2008-2018 in absolute numbers is about 5,300 though (or something like that).  Doesn&#8217;t seem like many jobs but then again I don&#8217;t know how to interpret these numbers. If you look at architects, they&#8217;re supposed to grow &#8220;faster than average&#8221;, but the actual number of new jobs is over 20,000.  The current OOH must have been published in 2007 or 2008 (based on data available at the time I presume)&#8230; I wonder if it is going to be updated based on current recession-era data (or if the online version has been already &#8211; I haven&#8217;t checked).  Anyway, these numbers would make all the difference to me if I were considering studying LA, which in my fantasy life I am, but for me it&#8217;s a non-starter.   I am 44, in debt, and not making use of my master&#8217;s degree which I am still paying off.  I am under-employed and have no retirement savings.  Read: not a lot of options for a fulfilling work life or happy retirement.  So, my fresh, young landscape architects, be glad that you have your degree, take whatever job you can get to put a roof over your head (like I have had to do), and get ANY LA-related experience you can.  Fortunately you are young and more flexible time-wise, financially, etc. (at least I hope you are!) and you can do internships and possibly unpaid work.  STAY OUT OF DEBT!  And, STAY THE COURSE!!!  If you want to work in LA, you might just have to be patient and ride out the recession.  Jobs in any profession ebb and flow, recession or no recession, it&#8217;s cyclical and to be expected.  Get any related experience you can, attend the conferences, etc.  You&#8217;ve got to commit to it or  forget it.  And if you don&#8217;t have your degree yet, double major.  That is not said to be discouraging, just practical.  Regardless of your major, I would suggest doubling.  It&#8217;s just smart.  Good luck all!  I hope your chosen professional works out.  Mine didn&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Harry</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-8838</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Harry]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Nov 2011 12:37:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-8838</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It seems to me that you are all missing the boat, the problem is not the the career you have chosen but what you are looking for, if you can&#039;t find a job create the job hit the pavement advertise start your own company, and take the work away from the people you have been trying to work for go out there and get them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems to me that you are all missing the boat, the problem is not the the career you have chosen but what you are looking for, if you can&#8217;t find a job create the job hit the pavement advertise start your own company, and take the work away from the people you have been trying to work for go out there and get them.</p>
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		<title>By: Lana</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-8299</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lana]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Oct 2011 21:15:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-8299</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Matt, 
Don&#039;t let these posts steer you away from LA. Remember you still have to actually complete some landscape architecture classes and see what you&#039;re getting yourself into. I&#039;m sure I can speak for most schools when I say that the first year of classes in LA programs &quot;weed out&quot; the people who don&#039;t really want to be in landscape architecture. Trust the program you&#039;re going into to show you if you really want it or not. For me, I went through an entire year and a half of architecture classes before I realized that I wanted to major in landscape architecture. I realized it later than sooner, but still found my passion.

Of course I would like to say don&#039;t worry about the recession, but that&#039;d be silly. Instead, contemplate a minor in horticulture, or like Monica suggested urban planning. If you continue on through college with a major in LA, focus on staying well-rounded in your skills; be able to balance mathematics (grading and such), computer and hand graphics and drafting, as well as attention to detail and how things are actually made/built and know plants! I just started an year long internship at an LA firm and one thing I&#039;m thankful for is that I&#039;m well-rounded.

Two last hints - 1. CONNECTIONS! Sometimes it doesn&#039;t matter how good you are, if you don&#039;t have connections, you&#039;re not going to have much luck getting a job. (I&#039;ve noticed it&#039;s how everyone in my office got their job - they knew someone who knew the principal) (**wink wink** teachers, ASLA conferences &amp; the annual LABash conference **wink wink**) 2. Intern as much as you can!! Experience is crucial in the LA world. I started off in a nursery for the summer after my sophmore year and during the school year was a teaching assistant for a few professors. Having letters of recommendation from a work as well as several from school were huge in getting me my internship.

Best wishes :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt,<br />
Don&#8217;t let these posts steer you away from LA. Remember you still have to actually complete some landscape architecture classes and see what you&#8217;re getting yourself into. I&#8217;m sure I can speak for most schools when I say that the first year of classes in LA programs &#8220;weed out&#8221; the people who don&#8217;t really want to be in landscape architecture. Trust the program you&#8217;re going into to show you if you really want it or not. For me, I went through an entire year and a half of architecture classes before I realized that I wanted to major in landscape architecture. I realized it later than sooner, but still found my passion.</p>
<p>Of course I would like to say don&#8217;t worry about the recession, but that&#8217;d be silly. Instead, contemplate a minor in horticulture, or like Monica suggested urban planning. If you continue on through college with a major in LA, focus on staying well-rounded in your skills; be able to balance mathematics (grading and such), computer and hand graphics and drafting, as well as attention to detail and how things are actually made/built and know plants! I just started an year long internship at an LA firm and one thing I&#8217;m thankful for is that I&#8217;m well-rounded.</p>
<p>Two last hints &#8211; 1. CONNECTIONS! Sometimes it doesn&#8217;t matter how good you are, if you don&#8217;t have connections, you&#8217;re not going to have much luck getting a job. (I&#8217;ve noticed it&#8217;s how everyone in my office got their job &#8211; they knew someone who knew the principal) (**wink wink** teachers, ASLA conferences &amp; the annual LABash conference **wink wink**) 2. Intern as much as you can!! Experience is crucial in the LA world. I started off in a nursery for the summer after my sophmore year and during the school year was a teaching assistant for a few professors. Having letters of recommendation from a work as well as several from school were huge in getting me my internship.</p>
<p>Best wishes <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Franklin</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-5748</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Franklin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Feb 2011 14:26:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-5748</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Come to Asia and get challenged. It will be a totally different experience. Guaranteed. It&#039;s not a panacea; far from it. But there is work, lots of it right now and it&#039;s difficult to find really good designers with some experience. Do it and change your life forever.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Come to Asia and get challenged. It will be a totally different experience. Guaranteed. It&#8217;s not a panacea; far from it. But there is work, lots of it right now and it&#8217;s difficult to find really good designers with some experience. Do it and change your life forever.</p>
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		<title>By: Trent Grantham, ASLA</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-4978</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Trent Grantham, ASLA]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 17:22:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-4978</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[When I graduated from college in &#039;93 (BSLA) landscape architecture positions were very hard to find as that was the last major downturn in the economy.  I didn&#039;t graduate with honors or from a prestigious university but was always able to find work.  Graduates today will need to seek out other opportunities that will lead to your dream job.  I worked for a nursery and several design/ build firms before landing a bona fide landscape architecture position.  Don&#039;t feel that you have to work in a firm to gain valuable knowledge in order to be successful.  Your young, work outside, enjoy your youth, live with less and learn everything you can it will pay off in the end.  There will be opportunities for you to learn construction, plant material and installation and when you do land that design firm job it will make you more valuable when you know how things are built and how much things cost.  One does not need to work in a firm just because you graduated from college with a degree.  Don&#039;t be lazy or give up.  Recent graduates will need to roll up their sleeves and actually work for a living.  When the jobs come back and positions are once again plentiful those who found jobs within the industry will get the call backs and interviews that have experience over those who didn&#039;t and it won&#039;t matter what college you went to or what your GPA was.  It&#039;s not where you go to school that makes you successful it&#039;s what you do after that counts.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I graduated from college in &#8217;93 (BSLA) landscape architecture positions were very hard to find as that was the last major downturn in the economy.  I didn&#8217;t graduate with honors or from a prestigious university but was always able to find work.  Graduates today will need to seek out other opportunities that will lead to your dream job.  I worked for a nursery and several design/ build firms before landing a bona fide landscape architecture position.  Don&#8217;t feel that you have to work in a firm to gain valuable knowledge in order to be successful.  Your young, work outside, enjoy your youth, live with less and learn everything you can it will pay off in the end.  There will be opportunities for you to learn construction, plant material and installation and when you do land that design firm job it will make you more valuable when you know how things are built and how much things cost.  One does not need to work in a firm just because you graduated from college with a degree.  Don&#8217;t be lazy or give up.  Recent graduates will need to roll up their sleeves and actually work for a living.  When the jobs come back and positions are once again plentiful those who found jobs within the industry will get the call backs and interviews that have experience over those who didn&#8217;t and it won&#8217;t matter what college you went to or what your GPA was.  It&#8217;s not where you go to school that makes you successful it&#8217;s what you do after that counts.</p>
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		<title>By: Monica</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-4728</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Monica]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2010 22:44:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-4728</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Matt, if you&#039;re worried about being a viable player in the field of Landscape Architecture, you may also want to consider getting a dual masters in LA and Urban Planning.  I work at the San Francisco Planning Department and many of our urban designers have dual MLA/MUP degrees.  Graduate level Landscape Architecture study will give you a lot of time to master the design scale; while the Urban Planning degree is more focused on the social context and understanding the project scope (as well as City codes and zoning and the like).  I think having the design degree combined with the practicality of a planning degree could make you an outstanding candidate for jobs.  Of course, you&#039;d have to be interested in the context of design.  And your success will always also depends on your ability to sell yourself in an interview, as well as a good dose of luck.  Go get &#039;em!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt, if you&#8217;re worried about being a viable player in the field of Landscape Architecture, you may also want to consider getting a dual masters in LA and Urban Planning.  I work at the San Francisco Planning Department and many of our urban designers have dual MLA/MUP degrees.  Graduate level Landscape Architecture study will give you a lot of time to master the design scale; while the Urban Planning degree is more focused on the social context and understanding the project scope (as well as City codes and zoning and the like).  I think having the design degree combined with the practicality of a planning degree could make you an outstanding candidate for jobs.  Of course, you&#8217;d have to be interested in the context of design.  And your success will always also depends on your ability to sell yourself in an interview, as well as a good dose of luck.  Go get &#8216;em!</p>
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		<title>By: Bill</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-4717</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bill]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Nov 2010 20:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-4717</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Matt, if you&#039;re still reading, stay on your path but pay attention to what doors it opens.  You&#039;ll be at a large university with a wealth of options.  If you love LA, great!  If you don&#039;t, you&#039;ll find something you do love.  Maybe your first class introduces you to GIS, or working in urban parks leads you to social work.  You get to explore, which is fun.

Even then, people now change careers a few times in their adult lives.  Skills transfer.  Make sure you pick up skills you enjoy using.

And think about a double major.  LAs are fairly interdisciplinary; many are self-employed.  So business is a good fit, as well as environmental science, civil engineering, sculpture, MCRP. All these complement the degree while giving you more options.  Maybe LA leads you into land-use policy and law school, or you pair it up with Chinese studies and move to Chengdu to work for a multinational firm.  Maybe a left-field addition, like a minor in chemistry, will serve you well when you fall back on med school.  You can also get majors in other fields and pursue the first-option MLA later.

Just know that everybody&#039;s suffering these days.  I just had dinner with a self-employed doctor who&#039;s struggling, and I know a few unemployed lawyers.  The economy&#039;s in the tank and no careers are guaranteed.  But you&#039;ll do something, so make it something you can live with.  Best of luck to you!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt, if you&#8217;re still reading, stay on your path but pay attention to what doors it opens.  You&#8217;ll be at a large university with a wealth of options.  If you love LA, great!  If you don&#8217;t, you&#8217;ll find something you do love.  Maybe your first class introduces you to GIS, or working in urban parks leads you to social work.  You get to explore, which is fun.</p>
<p>Even then, people now change careers a few times in their adult lives.  Skills transfer.  Make sure you pick up skills you enjoy using.</p>
<p>And think about a double major.  LAs are fairly interdisciplinary; many are self-employed.  So business is a good fit, as well as environmental science, civil engineering, sculpture, MCRP. All these complement the degree while giving you more options.  Maybe LA leads you into land-use policy and law school, or you pair it up with Chinese studies and move to Chengdu to work for a multinational firm.  Maybe a left-field addition, like a minor in chemistry, will serve you well when you fall back on med school.  You can also get majors in other fields and pursue the first-option MLA later.</p>
<p>Just know that everybody&#8217;s suffering these days.  I just had dinner with a self-employed doctor who&#8217;s struggling, and I know a few unemployed lawyers.  The economy&#8217;s in the tank and no careers are guaranteed.  But you&#8217;ll do something, so make it something you can live with.  Best of luck to you!</p>
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		<title>By: carrlaasla</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-4648</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[carrlaasla]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Oct 2010 19:22:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-4648</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You’re welcome Conor. Thank you for your post. Maybe we’ve shined a little light on all the gloomy folks out there. I know the last thing a person in school right now to get a landscape architecture degree needs to hear is that their time and money will be wasted.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You’re welcome Conor. Thank you for your post. Maybe we’ve shined a little light on all the gloomy folks out there. I know the last thing a person in school right now to get a landscape architecture degree needs to hear is that their time and money will be wasted.</p>
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		<title>By: Conor</title>
		<link>http://dirt.asla.org/2009/12/08/designintelligence-2010-landscape-architecture-program-rankings/#comment-4597</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Conor]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Oct 2010 02:38:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dirt.asla.org/?p=3501#comment-4597</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Carrlaasla,

Thanks for that post. I just spent well over an hour on different sites reading so many negative posts about the profession that I felt quite hopeless about what I have come to recognize as the work I wish to do for the rest of my life.

We need to put things in perspective. You don&#039;t need to look hard to find articles describing the dreadful state of so many professions. Even law school grads are having trouble finding work (I live with one in that boat) and lawyers with decades of experience and enviable salaries are being laid off from high profile firms. Landscape architecture is far from alone right now, I hope we can all recognize that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carrlaasla,</p>
<p>Thanks for that post. I just spent well over an hour on different sites reading so many negative posts about the profession that I felt quite hopeless about what I have come to recognize as the work I wish to do for the rest of my life.</p>
<p>We need to put things in perspective. You don&#8217;t need to look hard to find articles describing the dreadful state of so many professions. Even law school grads are having trouble finding work (I live with one in that boat) and lawyers with decades of experience and enviable salaries are being laid off from high profile firms. Landscape architecture is far from alone right now, I hope we can all recognize that.</p>
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